Things you would like to see changed in AA for NDK 2012

[darkshardsyuki]

Alright it is a bit early to start this for next year but I want to start while the application and the lottery are fresh in everyone's mind. This topic is for making suggestions on ways we can make Artists Alley even better. There are a few rules and things that will not talked about here and any posts about them will be ignored.

Rules: 1) keep things civil,
2) don't be afraid to make suggestions we want to get as many different ideas you can come up with,
3) Once Enigma or myself satisfactorily answered as to why or why not something will work the topic will dropped. Other staff members may answer the questions as well.

Things that will not be talked about: 1) No matter what First come, First serve will not be coming back ever or in any form so don't ask about it.

Topics that have been talked about

Lottery System
Q: Getting rid of the returners chance so that new artists have more of a chance to get in.
A: We will not be getting rid of the returners chance unless we have something equally beneficial, the returners chance is an incentive we give artists to reapply the next year, this doesn’t mean that we don’t get new artists, at least a third of artist alley is made up of new artists every year, sometimes more.

The Application

Artists Alley at the con and the layout

The contest

Other

[Squeeky_Moonkin]

I would suggest making your chance to get in decided by lottery also be jurried. I was informed that more then two artist selling cat ears made it in. I don't feel this is fair to other artist. I know these two artist making cat ears may have different styles, but I feel its limiting the chances for someone new or somone who could bring something unique/attendance raising  art to NDK's AA. Cat ears can be found at every con, and usually in both artist alley and the dealers hall.

This is coming from somone who applied for AA, had a returners chance, applied for with cat ears primarily as my craft, and still didn't make it in. So not complaining, but just think my opinion on this counts and comes from a strong source.

I would also suggest having the layout of artist alley maped out before the lottery. Then have folks then include  three desired locations where they would like to be seated in their application. Offer table placement by first come first serve out of the lottery system.

[darkshardsyuki]

When doing the lottery we do take into account the items being sold and how with crafts they are made. We take styles into account, for example with the cat ears, none of them are made exactly the same and you can see the differences with just a look.

As for the returners chance, we're looking into different options to replace it for next year, if you have any ideas fell free to to chime in.

Tables haven't changed much since last year, the main difference is the fact that we're directing the traffic through all of AA. For tables if someone wants a certain space or area the they have asked on the application, the same as for extra chairs, electricity, and space. To ask for everyone to pick places on top of that would make it nearly impossible to meet the any of the other requests. And we still don't and wont decide the placement of groups based in FCFS but how best we can meet all requests within the space we have.

edit: the change in returners chance is so we can make it fairer to new artists.

[Squeeky_Moonkin]

As far as table placement, some folks would regardless like to see the AA layout, that way they may notice their is a table/spot they would like to be located at. Not everyone who applies to NDK's AA has been before and may not be failiar with the layout. I know it doesn't guarantee the individual would receive requested location, but I am sure that if said location was available, and met the table needs/availability by both parties, then I see offering a layout to those applying as a good change.

I think the contest you did last yr was a great way to have some Artist hopefully return again. Though I would probably line out, what the individual won/will be receiving. Does it only include the table space? Or does it cover the table fee to get into AA as well? Does the winner not have to be placed into the lottery in regards to what items they can and can not sell, so long as meeting the ratings for NDK. As, do they get first dibs on being permitted to sell a certain craft and if by chance somone form the lottery has a similar item and is to be declined the chance to sell "said item" because the winner of the contest won that privilege.

[darkshardsyuki]

I'll see about putting up a map off AA at a later date. But request wise it comes down to a returning artist asking for the same or similar spot, requests for space by the low wall, against a wall, or in an aisle. Seeing the map and requesting a space in addition to the dozens of requests *for certains spaces, space, electricity, and extra chairs* we already recieve would mean very few people would get the things they requested and then no one would be happy. And just for the record we had as many new artists make requests as returning one.

If people want to make a certain space request in addition to any other requests they might have they are free to do so when they fill out the application, there is already a space provided for it, otherwise we will place them in an open space after we have met the other requests. There will be no "pick 3 location choices given" or anything similar.

Contest winners win a space without having to go through the lottery, they still have to apply and pay like everyone else and meet the deadlines. The question of first dibs didn't come up this year because all 3 winners have products that were different, they still had to get their products approved just like everyone else, but if it had come down to a lottery about a product item they would have had the same chance as the others applying for said item.

[Breanna]

I noticed that there are some tables that no one uses. Especially on Sunday. I was wondering if they are not being used, they could be put away or just set on a wall so that there is more room for others. It gets really crowded pretty easily. Usually the outside ones near the back are unoccupied so I don't know if it would make much of a difference.

On the note as to where to put it. The table can be collapsed on a wall unused by the AA and near its space so that if the Artist who are suppose to use it come by, they can open it up and start setting it up without disturbing the crowd.

[darkshardsyuki]

We have already taken steps listed clearly in the rules about set up times and check in times, they will hopefully prevent there from being any tables left empty for extended peroids of time especially when AA is most active. While the tables can be taken down, we would like to keep them in place until it is time to tear down on Sunday.

[Lusha]

Im not quite sure if this has been mentioned yet, i looked through quickly but didnt quite see any thing, but Perhaps maybe rearrange the set up of the tables to try and make it easier to keep flowing.  Behavior for not blocking the way is pretty well maintained but even then it can be a bit narrow while carrying your new stuff and a bit difficult to try to stay out of the way for people who are trying to get by and weave in between those who are trying to go the other way and and those who are looking at the art. 

[darkshardsyuki]

We are hoping with by directing the flow of traffic and a couple more staff members and volunteers that we will be able to keep the traffic steady. No pictures in AA will also help because then people wont be stopping to get shots of cosplayers and blocking traffic. We can't change AA from its current setup without taking out tables, which would mean less artists but we may be able to open a little bit of space between the aisles but no more then a foot or two.

[rini]

i'm going to throw in a heug pile of worms. but, i'd like to see what NDK's take on this is.

there's been a trend going on in cons all across the US of either severely limiting, or completely eliminating fan art in AA. that means that all your work has to be original properties. for example: we just got word that anime iowa is merging their AA with dealers, and that all artists have to comply with the same rules that dealers have, i.e., all licensed merchandise.

otakon has a rule that severely limits the number of fan art you can sell. i can't remember exactly what this number is. i believe AX has a similar policy.

i'm not sure what the reason is for this, i can only guess. 1) don't want to deal with possible copyright violation; 2) change AA back to what it originally was, where artists sold their own work, and not fan art. 3) get more variety.

i have no opinion on the matter. i'm just curious to see what other ppl think about it, and if NDK is thinking about heading in that direction for their AA.

[darkshardsyuki]

I'll leave that topic open for discussion here so the artists can chime in but to limit or eliminate fan art we'd have to do the same for any crafts that are made to represent anything that appeared in anything licensed. It's an interesting concept and it'd be neat to see what new items artists and craftsmen could come up with, I'm pretty sure we'd never completely eliminate fan art or craft but limiting it might be a possibility.

[Angiechan]

For the AA itself, I would recommend adding another room to the Alley--since it has been made clear that changing the location of the AA isn't an option. I remember a few conventions where the AA was broken up into sections in different rooms--mainly because they did not want to exclude any artists willing to come. 

Despite the fact that NDK is trying to be fair by instituting the lottery, they also risk excluding artists who would otherwise enjoy attending.  For example, I missed last year and I lost out on the lottery this year--at what point do I realize that I can't consider myself a "returning artist," give up on NDK and focus my efforts on going to other venues like AWA or DragonCon instead?

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The changes in fanart policy also works to discourage the artists whose sole purpose is to "mass produce" fanart and sell it at anime conventions.  There are several artists who are notorious for this--to include the one who infamously bought 8 tables at AX's AA a few years ago (which led to additional rules there). Rini's observations are also spot on, as those are additional reasons many AAs have added fanart restrictions.

*soapbox time*
I know many people dislike it, but I think it is a good thing for artists who want to improve. Part of improving is to step beyond the works laid out by other people.  For example, most of my resin pieces are original (with me creating new designs every year)  and I aim to create at least one original picture for every fanart that I do. Granted I may not sell as many prints as some others who focus on fanart, I am still pleased with the interest and my charms/resin pieces consistently have done well regardless.

On a sentimental note,  I lost a dear friend suddenly a couple of years ago. Some of you may know her as Hakubaikou--and she was an amazing artist.  We hung out for several years at anime conventions other than NDK, so her loss was pretty hard on many of us who attended AAs with her.  What struck me after her passing was that I could look at her artwork and for a blissful moment I can look at them and forget the fact that she gone. While she did some fanarts, they pale in comparison to her original works.

The revelation that many of her friends had at that timeframe was that one will likely never be remembered for fanarts.  However, by creating truly inspiring originals, in a sense you can immortalize yourself and leave a beautiful reminder of what you loved enough to create.

[Squeeky_Moonkin]

I would have to disagree with the thought of placing AA in two rooms. Anime Banza did this two years ago. The room on the left didn't have nearly the same traffic flow at all as the room on the right. I know this first hand, as I was int he room on the ;left, and a friend in on the right. It was horrible. Also some folks once they enter one room, may loose intrest in goign into another. Some attendees might also not be able to tell or become informed of sucha  change. So if NDK was to even consider this an option I highly recommend the two rooms are joined  and one room is the entrance, while the other is the exit.  Even tough it limits the number of artist, I think where AA has been held is a perfect spot.

For the AA itself, I would recommend adding another room to the Alley--since it has been made clear that changing the location of the AA isn't an option. I remember a few conventions where the AA was broken up into sections in different rooms--mainly because they did not want to exclude any artists willing to come. 

Despite the fact that NDK is trying to be fair by instituting the lottery, they also risk excluding artists who would otherwise enjoy attending.  For example, I missed last year and I lost out on the lottery this year--at what point do I realize that I can't consider myself a "returning artist," give up on NDK and focus my efforts on going to other venues like AWA or DragonCon instead?

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[darkshardsyuki]

Per our contract with the hotel we wouldn't be able to expand AA into other areas, even another room. Also those rooms are used for panels, video gaming, the art show, and video. To take a room away from one of those would be unfair to the groups whose space it is. AA has to stay within the atrium where it is now, which means we cant expand.

The lottery and FCFS both have draw backs, even with the way it was there was still drawbacks on space, even someone who as you said enjoys attending could be excluded if they weren't fast enought. The lottery gives us a chance to bring in a good number of artists who wouldn't have applied if it was a different system or couldn't afford to be up for the midnight rush, the only way we could almost get all the artists in with the space we have would be to limit everyone to half a table which we wouldn't do. That means that not everyone who whats in would be able to get in, we do have some movement on the waitlist but we still have to work within the space we have.

I'm sorry you lost a friend, that is a wonderful memory you have of her and her work.

[Squeeky_Moonkin]

I can't recall, but does NDK AA offer, let alone have room for those who would want to apply but would supply their own display fixtures (not needing a table)? This may squeeze in a few more artist, if there is such room for this option. Most likely, I am sure you are so full and it is not an option.

[darkshardsyuki]

There is no room to squeeze people into extra space cause there is no extra space, in the past if an artist needed a space without the table they would still be limited to the space they would have had with the table but we don't set one up so they can have a kind of walk in display. A two table group had such a display a few years ago.

[Vonchaos]

I know at Starfest (held in the same hotel) they expand the AA a few tables in front of the coffee shop (501 and Rebel Alliance Set up a Hoth and Han Solo in Carbonite Display with a few tables).  Also Monster Machine computers took a Wi Fi hub at the front of the hotel to the right of the main entrance (next to the Business center).  Maybe A few Hub rooms could be used for NDK. 
The banquet room near the North East Side would be nice to put to use too (the room under were the game room was last year, it is listed on the hotels map as "F" food ).

Expanding into other areas:

Also It maybe nice to see if there could be a few tables along the sidewalks, like an outdoor fair.  I realize this might be a problem for foot traffic on side walks, But, I would set up a few scooping games (goldfish, water balloon yoyo, rubber balls).   Because that would be freaking awesome! I am sure a few outdoor vendors would like to set up.  I bet the local anime clubs would love to have a booth making contest!  It would be something people can enjoy while out and about watching the cosplay groups do photos. Rules could be written up easily and I would happily volunteer myself and friends to supervise this anytime.

At night: The Tables for the con badges could get use in the evening with a comic (original art, comic, manga only fair)/autograph session.  I would also like to see the AA open at night.   That bar is a nice place for 21 and up crowd.  The rave could benefit from some glow stick merchants.  It could appease the adult crowds with merchandise not offered during the day. But I guess that would have to be supervised would be the problem.  But Hey its an Idea.

Let the con get 24hr activities and people will come up with ideas for the spaces that the con organizers leave at 6pm.

Thanks for reading all that.  I look forward to reading your feedback. 

[darkshardsyuki]

The NDK contract is different then the Starfest contract, we are only aloud to sell items in three areas Dealers, Merch, and AA,*4 if you count art and model*  we cannot expand into other areas of the hotel to sell for these areas according to the contract, including outside. Also Colorado weather being what it is we could go from sunny to snowy at any time so it would be unfair as well to anyone set up outside.

AA is open until midnight if an artist wishes to stay that late, most everyone chooses not to because there are few attendies shopping after 10-11. Glow sticks are a bought product and cannot be sold in AA. And even with a 24 hour cycle lots of artists whould disagree with the 6pm close time since many stay open until after the costume contest is done on Saturday, it also makes no since on Friday either since many artists don't arrive until after school is out and Sunday AA closes at 5. So the hours wouldn't change to a 24 hour cycle. Thanks for the suggestions.

[Vonchaos]

Ah well, that's unfortunate.  But thanks for the feedback.  I'll make sure to tell people.

[Jalakins]

I was reading through a few posts and I thought I'd throw in my two cents - I would be extremely disappointed if fanart was no longer allowed. I have some personal favorite characters from certain games/anime and I looove seeing people's renditions on characters. "Chibis" would be a good example. While I agree that an artist does have to have original work in order to improve and be unique, I would also say that each artist's style is also a unique feature. My favorite artists tend to be ones that sell fanart and original art. And this year, I moved into an apartment and have an entire room that needs something on the walls. I know that I will be looking for both types of art to fill up my empty walls.